Project Research - Have your say

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by Flapdoddle, Sep 11, 2014.

  1. Flapdoddle

    Flapdoddle Witchmarsh Developer

    The role of research in game development is a nebulous one, seldom discussed or given significance outside of pre-production. When it comes to a historical game like Witchmarsh, we believe that it takes on a greater significance. Without submerging ourselves in literature of and about the decade, we could miss out on some vital insights surrounding the period in which the game is set.

    By making this list open to the community we're hoping to do something rather different. By involving you, the player, in our project research we hope to learn more about your influences, and vice versa.

    Feel free to suggest relevant books, games, TV shows or movies to incorporate into our schedule. These don't have to be 1920s related, but some link to the project is preferred. It could be an expertly crafted mystery, a game with great character design or your favourite book of the Jazz Era.

    What impact will this have on the project? We couldn't possibly say, as far as we know this has never been attempted before. Whatever the outcome we're looking forward to reading your suggestions. Thanks for helping us shape the development of Witchmarsh. :)

    Games
    - The Banner Saga. Queued.
    - Wizardry 8. In Progress. 'About to head to Ascension Peak.'
    - Baldur's Gate II. In Progress. 'Revisiting after 5-6 years.'
    - Dragon Warrior 8. Queued.
    - Shadowrun Returns/Dragonfall. Played. 'Wow, some of the best writing we've seen in modern* games. Highly recommended.'
    - Planescape: Torment. In Progress. 'It's criminal that we're only just playing it now.'

    Books
    - One Summer: 1927. Read. 'A funny and informative look into 1920s America.'
    - Various Works - Arthur Conan Doyle. In Progress.
    - Boardwalk Empire. Read.
    - Various Works - H. P. Lovecraft. Check out Lou's progress here.
    - The Diamond as Big as the Ritz & Other Stories - F. Scott Fitzgerald. In Progress.
    - The Beautiful and Damned - F. Scott Fitzgerald. Read.
    - Witchcraft: A History - P G Maxwell Stewart.
    In Progress.
    - Careless People - Sarah Churchwell. Read.
    - The Adventures of Sally - P. G. Wodehouse. Read.
    - The Paris Wife - Paula Mclain. Read. 'Hemmingway in the 20s. Set in Paris but still an interesting read.'
    - Various Works - Rex Stout. Queued. 'Recommended to us by a fan on twitter. The're set in the 30s but seem to be worth a look.'

    Films
    - Sunrise. Queued.
    - The Aviator.

    TV
    - Boardwalk Empire. In Progress.


    YouTube
    - Extra Credits. In Progress. 'Great stuff!'

    Do
    Recommend things to add to this list, and if possibly explain why they're relevant to the project or game development.

    Don't
    Get into arguments regarding the items on this list or criticise other people's suggestions. Please try to keep it relevant to the subject of research and the project. :)

    Updated: 12/11/14
    * = Edited for clarification.
     
      Last edited: Sep 12, 2014
      Captain Rage, mollygos, Leth and 2 others like this.
    • LongChan

      LongChan Cosmic Narwhal

      Hey there, I'm LongChan and I come from Starbound's forum. I saw Witchmarsh for the first time in one of the posts in Starbound's blog and I fell in love with it instantly. It seems the game is going to have a nice dose of mysteries and riddles. Taking that fact into account, I would recommend giving Brain Lord for the Snes a try. Also Phantasy Star IV because it has a great storyline and coop-attacks which might fit in a game where teamwork and cooperation seem to be vital.
       
      • jamsus

        jamsus Space Hobo

        Uhm, i reccomend:

        Books
        Robert W. Chambers novels, in particular The King in Yellow - which would be sooo connected to 1920 mistery\investigation mood
        Edgar Allan Poe novels

        TV-Series\Related
        Is not 20' related, but is based on Chambers novels so... True Detective
        Maybe, Carnival?

        Games
        Call of Cthulhu, Dark Corners of the Earth
         
        • Rugerfred

          Rugerfred Big Damn Hero

          Woah, pretty cool suggestions! :)

          I've got some for you:

          Game:
          - Darkness Within: probably the best lovecraftian point & click adventure. Very psychological and mysterious. I totally suggest it, it's a must-play.
          - Call of Cthulhu: Dark corner of the Earth: pretty interesting "survival fps". I didn't like much the second half of the game, but the first one is great.

          Books:
          - All China MiƩville works, especially the Bas-Lag trilogy, King Rat and The City & The City. Some of them are set in modern days, but the setting is alway intriguing, tense and well crafted.
          - All the Dresden Files books: if you love Shadowrun Returns/Dragonfall, you'll love this. Don't watch the shitty TV Series: read directly the book. Great setting, tense stories, hard boiled everything, folklore reference and a lot of badassery. Totally suggested. A must read.

          Hoping that will be useful for you, sorry for my english, i'm an italian Kickstarter backer... ;)
           
          • St.Alfonzzo

            St.Alfonzzo Yeah, You!

            looking forward to this project, love that you guys are doing a bunch of research into it as well.

            I might recommend the book Dandelion Wine by Ray Bradbury. It basically recounts events in a small American town over the course of one summer in 1928, a lot of which is from the perspective of the 12-year-old main character. It's a lot of beautiful descriptive language about summertime in rural America, and there's interesting stories that have a tinge of the mystic, or supernatural.

            could be useful for building atmosphere, or something like that. a good book either way
             
            • Randall Laine

              Randall Laine Space Hobo

              I would recomend Dresden Files. (The book series not the tv series.)
              Its modern supernatural. Wizard private Eye in a world where every myth (Faire courts, trolls under bridges, vampires of different types, odin and Santa Clause are real.) It sounds like a potential read even if it is set recently.
              And like Rugerfred above me said
              As for games and tv hmm... Supernatural possibly for TV although I tend to not like how it comes down to either "Stab it with a knife, custom ingredient or shoot it" solutions only, despite the itneresting characters it can have.
              Game wise in relation to Witchmarsh, I believe...Hmm... I'll need to get back to you on that one.
               
                Rugerfred likes this.
              • gruia

                gruia Space Hobo

                kinda dissapointed with your affirmation of shadowrun. Especially while you're playing PSTourment

                THeres plenty of great writing in classic games, Lucas Arts were geniuses

                Imo I'd want youreading DOstoyevski and PKdick non stop while developing this game ) but thats just me
                 
                • Cerbius

                  Cerbius Void-Bound Voyager

                  Game: Eldritch
                   
                  • ledeir

                    ledeir Void-Bound Voyager

                    Regarding Shadowrun Returns / Dragonfall - hopefully you are praising Dragonfall rather than Dead Man's Switch. (DMS was fun but lacking. DF was much better) ;)

                    Regarding Dresden Files - If you haven't already, I do recommend them as well! I wanted to add a disclaimer, if you are going to watch the TV series (which is a completely different animal than the books), watch it first. In my experience most people who saw the TV series first enjoyed it, but those who read the books first felt very strongly against it. I saw the series first and enjoyed it. If I hadn't seen the series I never would have started reading the books (which, I agree, are FAR better).

                    Another author which you might find useful is CJ Henderson. He was a very prolific author with a lot of Lovecraftian stories.
                    I particularly recommend his Teddy London and Piers Knight series. Though they are set in the wrong time period, they probably have the right mood.
                     
                      Rugerfred likes this.
                    • Tweak

                      Tweak Scruffy Nerf-Herder

                      When brushing up on the period and looking into art like "The Treachery of Images," I found my way to Alfred Korzybski. You may already know that Korzybski's general semantics describes us as being limited in what we know. If you intend to make a game that capitalizes on the unknown, then it may be complementary to question the ability to know.

                      "Manhood of Humanity," is just the beginning of general semantics and doesn't introduce much beyond the human ability to prosper off of the past, but "Science and Sanity" may be valuable to you. Fairly difficult reads, but I know no alternatives for such subject matter.
                       
                        Last edited: Sep 13, 2014
                      • smudboy

                        smudboy Space Spelunker

                        I second with ledeir. Dragonfall is where the writing is, while Dead Man's Switch was lacking.

                        If you're going the mythology/legends/Judeo-Christian/Castlevania: Symphony of the Night route, Lucifer DC comics is all kinds of wonderful horror.

                        However, I strongly recommend focusing on plot and characterization of your band of merry detectives/ghostbusters/antagonists; more in the Baldur's Gate 2(Irenicus)/Dragon Age(party banter) vein. Class based interactions/dialog is the way to go. And since you don't have to worry about voice acting, you can go crazy with things like a Chrono Cross Accent System, to give everyone an interesting, spoken vibe. I'm sure you've got the idle animations all down pat.
                         
                        • Riobux

                          Riobux Void-Bound Voyager

                          Games
                          Eternal Darkness: Sanity's Requiem. It's a Lovecraftian game based in various times in history.
                          Max Payne 1 & 2. Both games have a heavy noir feel, but it also has a very nice sense of humour about it. Is based in the modern day, but the style of story-telling and the weird humour it has does work well.
                          Zero Escape: Virtue's Last Reward. I wasn't sure if to recommend this as it isn't a noir game, nor Lovecraftian at all. However, as games go in terms of creating plot twists which are hinted at without feeling obvious, Zero Escape: Virtue's Last Reward does pull it off really well. Every twist in the game is hinted, yet come out of nowhere in a spectacular style. Not to mention, the game never lies to preserve mystery. It's also a game that introduces things like Schroedinger's Cat in an accessible way that doesn't talk down to you. I'd recommend checking out 999 before hand as it does relate to the game somewhat, but it's not necessary. It may help to work out how to present complex subjects in an understandable way, and how to hint at twists and turns in the plot without feeling obvious or blind-siding a player. Not to mention, it does propose a very interesting mystery generally. However, I wouldn't blame you guys if you gave it a miss.

                          Pen-And-Paper
                          Honestly, it may help to take a glance at the Call Of Cthulhu tabletop rules, and maybe one or two campaigns like Masks Of Nyarlathotep. May help in terms of presentation styles, and how to perhaps convey mystery and madness in a mechanical and/or alluding manner.
                           
                            Last edited: Sep 12, 2014
                          • Bill Sykes

                            Bill Sykes Void-Bound Voyager

                            I've seen plenty of talk of games and books but not much about films so I thought I'd give my two cents.

                            Since we are in charge of a band of detectives, I thought perhaps a few detective films would be useful. Now although not set in the 1920's, the genre of film-noir has some of the best detective movies to date! Films such as:
                            - 'The Big Sleep',
                            - 'Chinatown'
                            - 'Double Indemnity'
                            have some of the most grittiest and engrossing story lines in cinema history in my opinion.

                            In terms of films that capture the spirit of the 1920's:
                            - 'Midnight in Paris' by Woody Allen
                            - 'The Great Gatsby' (2013 version) by Baz Lurman
                            - 'Some Like it Hot' by Billy Wilder

                            All three of these capture the raucous opulence of the 1920's! Truly fantastic.

                            Hope this will be of some use, and keep up the good work old chaps ;)
                             
                            • Riobux

                              Riobux Void-Bound Voyager

                              In terms of films, I recall Dark City being a nice noir film with a nice oddness to it. Just, the less you know about the film the better due to the twists and turns. It's a film where even the trailers spoil the film.
                               
                              • SwarmOfBees

                                SwarmOfBees Space Hobo

                                I haven't seen anyone mention horror films of the 1920s yet, so I'm going to go ahead and recommend Nosferatu (1922) and the Cabinet of Dr. Caligari (1920) as good examples of what was going on in the genre around that time. Dr. Mabuse: The Gambler (1922), about a criminal mastermind who is also a hypnotist and a master of disguise, might also be worth looking at, even though it's more pulp crime than horror. And of course there's Metropolis (1927), which has plenty of weird and striking imagery that you could perhaps plumb for ideas.

                                More recently, Shadow of the Vampire (2000) is a film about the making of Nosferatu, with the twist that the lead actor happens to be a real vampire. Personally, I like the idea of a film crew (or some other outsider group) unaware that one of their own is a monster as the basis for some type of quest.

                                For books, maybe Red Harvest (1929) by Dashiell Hammett? A town is being torn apart by rival gangs and an outsider detective has to get rid of them by playing them against one another. Could provide inspiration for characters and/or quests.

                                Jeeves and Wooster is a British TV show that adapted a bunch of P.G. Wodehouse's stories. About as far from horror as you can get, but it's pretty funny and has lots of period detail that could provide inspiration. Maybe there are some ideas for the Gentleman character waiting to be discovered here?

                                For games, there's the Laura Bow games from Sierra. They're... not great games (almost impossible to win without a walkthrough), but they're both mysteries set in the 1920s, which I guess makes them kind of relevant? Again, a good amount of period detail which could be useful.
                                 
                                • dulan

                                  dulan Intergalactic Tourist

                                  Another film, which again, not quite 1920's, but has sufficiently deranged and dark themes: City Of Lost Children.
                                   
                                  • Leaf_It

                                    Leaf_It Tentacle Wrangler

                                    Game: They Bleed Pixels.
                                    Its a side scrolling platformer with a heavily lovecraftian influence. Not too sure of the time line, but its seems to be about the 1920s - 1940s ish? I don't think you need to play through all of it, just the first few levels to get the feel of it.
                                     
                                    • Attack_Fish

                                      Attack_Fish Phantasmal Quasar

                                      I haven't heard of any project research. Is the team researching the culture back in the 1920's? If so, the music from any era always takes me time traveling!

                                      EDIT: Roll of Thunder Hear My Cry is a GREAT book written about that era! A must read for everyone.
                                       
                                        Last edited: Sep 14, 2014
                                      • Leth

                                        Leth Risk of Rain & Wanderlust

                                        Board Game - Eldritch Horror <3
                                         
                                        • Evene

                                          Evene Space Hobo

                                          I think in Books "Jules Vernes - A Journey to the Center of the Earth" would suit well with the other things listed. It's a bit before 1920 but it's Science Fiction still relevant to this day. So mixed together I think it would be interesting for your project.
                                           

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